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No Friends but the Mountains:; The Fate of the Kurds
Topic Started: Mar 29 15, 12:28 (2,203 Views)
Jim M
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R. Sergeant Major

An except from the article: "No Friends but the Mountains: The Fate of the Kurds"

Terry Glavin March/April 2015

"At one end, Massoud Barzani’s Kurdistan Democratic Party (KDP) dominates South Kurdistan and controls the semi-autonomous Kurdistan Regional Government. Its history includes a stint as a de facto Soviet client against Iran and another brief stint as a Khomeinist proxy during the Iran-Iraq War, for which the Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein later viciously punished the Kurds, slaughtering tens of thousands in his Anfal campaign, most notoriously in his nerve-gas bombing of Halabja.

Over the years, the KDP has evolved into a populist and nationalist party. It has eclipsed the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan of Barzani’s lifelong adversary Jalal Talabani, who was Iraq’s first democratically elected president in 2005. The KDP’s lukewarmness toward pan-Kurdish independence comes from a wariness about the compromises its success would require vis-à-vis South Kurdistan’s neighbors, not least the Kurds’ belligerent Turkish adversaries in Ankara.

At the other pole is an array of parties and armed groups inspired by Abdullah Ocalan, the charismatic insurrectionist whose Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK) led an armed uprising that spiraled out of control during the dark days following Turkey’s military coup in the early 1980s and carried on intermittently until 2013.

Because the PKK is outlawed in Turkey, NATO countries list the organization as a terrorist entity, and indeed some of the PKK’s early conduct would fit the description of “terrorism.” This complicates matters as well for the Syrian Kurds, whose dominant Democratic Union Party and Local Protection Force (YPG) guerrillas are intimately linked with the PKK. Ocalan also enjoys the loyalty of a militant constituency in Iran’s Kurdish underground.

Just as Massoud Barzani now has more important things to worry about than the challenge of carving out an independent Kurdistan from the four states that enclose the Kurdish homelands, Ocalan’s thinking has also radically evolved over time. He is no longer the Dear Leader figure of a classic and brutal Marxist-Leninist third-world liberation movement, and has lately taken on the persona of a kind of Kurdish Nelson Mandela.

Just as Mandela was imprisoned for eighteen of his twenty-seven years behind bars on Robben Island off the South African Coast, Ocalan has been imprisoned since 1999 on Imrali Island, in the Sea of Marmara, off Istanbul. Ocalan’s politics have lately drawn from such diverse sources as the works of the late American libertarian-socialist philosopher Murray Bookchin. Ocalan’s movement in Turkey has adopted a focus on a form of nonviolent democratic decentralization. And it’s working, at least in its emphasis on democratic control of municipal and regional governments and avoiding direct confrontations with Erdogan’s government in Ankara.

But the main thing that preoccupies Kurds across the political spectrum now is a more immediate and necessary focus on the priority of survival. This isn’t a historical anomaly. It is only rarely that the Kurds have enjoyed any reprieve from their calamities."

http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/article/no-friends-mountains-fate-kurds
Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs:

"Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your
enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow."

"Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords."

"Those who do not go to war roar like a lion."

"Everything is pardoned the brave."

"Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size."

"A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many."
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ALAN
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That was before now we have allies :)
Russian Girenak Joseph, who visited Kirkuk in Kurdistan as a part of his tour throu the 1870 - 1873 AD, who published the results of his trip & his studies later in 1879, in the 4th volume in the Bulletin of the Caucasus department of the Royal Geographical Russian Society estimated Kirkuk's population as many as 12-50,000 people, & he emphasized that except 40 Christian families, the rest of the population were Kurds. As for The Turkmen & Arabs, they have not been already existed at the time.
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Jim M
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ALAN
Mar 29 15, 12:38
That was before now we have allies :)
Did you even read the article?
Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs:

"Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your
enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow."

"Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords."

"Those who do not go to war roar like a lion."

"Everything is pardoned the brave."

"Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size."

"A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many."
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Partizan
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Quote:
 
Ocalan’s thinking has also radically evolved over time. He is no longer the Dear Leader figure of a classic and brutal Marxist-Leninist third-world liberation movement, and has lately taken on the persona of a kind of Kurdish Nelson Mandela.
Fcking depressing that this is considered positive in the eyes of outsiders. Ocalan's thinking has not 'evolved' by any means, it devolved. Ocalan wallows in senility, from his constant avoidance of armed conflict to the ridiculous concept of 'democratic autonomy', the purpose of which is really just for the PKK to maintain a purpose after failing in its objective of expelling the Turks and establishing a state. It was after a line of military failures in the mid-90s (which were caused by Ocalan ignoring his commanders' advice regarding changing Turkish strategy) that Ocalan dropped the demand for independence.

I'm aware that Ocalan's distancing from a "brutal Marxist-Leninist" personality to the capitulating, politically correct abomination he is now would appear as positive to the Western ethos with its Cold-War hangups, but the fact is that it was in their "brutal Marxist-Leninist" days that the PKK achieved most success, that they had Turgut Ozal coming to bargaining table on his own initiative, that they sent Turkish soldiers back to their mothers in body bags and through retaliations (which they are incapable of now) deterred Turks from committing the kind of excesses that are becoming normal again in recent years, accompanied by increasing Kurdish tolerance for these abuses.

The PKK's purpose was to expel Turkish occupation using revolutionary violence. Ethics, human rights or international respectability were never considerations, and have only shown themselves to be ridiculous impediments ever since Ocalan and the PKK underwent their so-called "evolution". The author of this article is doing us a disservice by propagating approval for decisions that have worked against our interests. If only he realized that for the PKK to have ever stood a chance of success it would have had to commit to a level of violence and 'terrorism' far beyond what seems sufficient for him to disapprove of, I wonder then whether the Kurdish struggle in Bakur would be really something for him to preoccupy himself with. If the Ocalan of old was brutal, then the man to have succeeded in expelling the Turks would be on the level of Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot.
Edited by Partizan, Mar 29 15, 8:58.
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Jim M
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"Fcking depressing that this is considered positive in the eyes of outsiders."

"Outsiders" L.O.L. the incredible amount of venom I've encountered in this forum from communist cowards is beyond the pale. Your attitude towards "outsiders" and such a backwards philosophy as yours it makes me wonder if Kurds like you will ever amount to anything on the worlds stage.

I don't understand why none of you show the famous Peshmerga hospitality or even a modicum of respect. I can only assume its a form of cowardice and small minded mean spirited nastiness that is typical of adherence to communism.

Regards,

Jim M lol
Edited by Jim M, Mar 29 15, 6:24.
Kurdish Wisdom of War Proverbs:

"Deal with your friends as if they will become your enemies tomorrow, and deal with your
enemies as if they will become your friends tomorrow."

"Those away from the battlefield boast about their swords."

"Those who do not go to war roar like a lion."

"Everything is pardoned the brave."

"Whoever digs a pit for his enemy should dig it his own size."

"A thousand friends are too few; one enemy is one too many."
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Partizan
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Care to address any of the points I made? No? Then I take the liberty to call your reply trash. If your next reply looks like this one I will not indignify myself writing another response to it.

Quote:
 
"Outsiders"
Yes, this is an accurate description of the author and other commentators or self-appointed 'analysts' on Kurdish politics. Detailed information about Kurdistan mostly circulates among Kurds, therefore non-Kurds have no complete overview of the facts unless they communicate with us on a daily basis, and this affects their evaluations. Those who applaud Ocalan's ideas actually think he experienced an enlightenment of sorts and gave us 'democratic autonomy' out of a desire to serve his people. What they are not aware of is that his concession of independence came after military failures on the PKK's part (which you would only read about on forums like ours or in books), in other words Ocalan considered it necessary to moderate the PKK's goals in the face of decreasing likelihood that the PKK would ever succeed in its original objective. It's a capitulation, nothing else.

Ocalan and PKK nowadays don't even demand autonomy anymore. In their incomprehensible quest to negotiate with Turks their demands are vague and undefined: "democratic rights", "democratic equality", etcetera.

It's funny how you appear have assumed I used the word 'outsiders' in some xenophobic context, this is not the case. Non-Kurds don't know all the facts and thus get the wrong impression, simple as that.
Jim M
 
the incredible amount of venom I've encountered in this forum from communist cowards is beyond the pale. Your attitude towards "outsiders" and such a backwards philosophy as yours it makes me wonder if Kurds like you will ever amount to anything on the worlds stage.
The bolded parts here signify everything I hate about the so-called 'support' for Kurds from the West. It only exists on the condition of Kurds adopting stupid Western ideals like democracy and human rights, which have failed us from the inception of the KRG on, in ways too many to list. Should Kurdish leaders come to their senses and chuck that garbage in the bin, it will become apparent just how vacuous, shallow and unreliable this international support is. We will return to being regarded as violent outlaws with an evil nationalism. And worst of all, Kurds in their emotional insecurity and desperation for esteem and acceptance are delighted at their newfound 'hero' status in the media and are betting all their cards on this coming support.

Fortunately there is more than one world power and we have alternatives, Russia and especially China unlike the West don't set any cultural demands on their allies, in addition to having less vested interests in the region and less committed relations with our enemies than the West does. Russia is less committed to protecting and supporting Iran than NATO is to its member Turkey. I think we can slam the door in the face of those whose 'support' comes with ridiculous conditions without serious consequences. And if it did, so what, Cambodia was recuperating just fine toward the end of Khmer Rouge rule after the initial shock in 1975, and even under total isolation it won't ever come to that in Kurdistan unless our government too did insane things like killing off the intelligentsia and banning machines.

P.S I am not really a communist or Marxist, however as I am communicating with a disciple of Ayn Rand here I can't really be bothered making distinctions that I know wouldn't make a difference to you. Just suffice it to say that I believe in a state-planned economy without markets, that is where my affinities with communism end.
Edited by Partizan, Mar 30 15, 12:09.
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Şirnex
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Partizan
Mar 29 15, 2:17
If the Ocalan of old was brutal, then the man to have succeeded in expelling the Turks would be on the level of Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot.
agree
talabani = jash
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